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Author Topic: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ  (Read 8574 times)

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Offline 01sahara

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Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« on: October 20, 2008, 08:04:10 PM »
I recived this from Peter Straub and was asked to post it so pepole could send him input.


Greetings fellow Four Wheelers.

As you may recall, I am representing the 4x4 community on the Ghost Stewardship Monitoring Group. This group has been active now for 2 years. We finalized our team charter in April 2007. I became the chair of the Trail Sub-committee 11 months ago, and in that time we've approved trail criteria, created a conceptual trail plan for the South West area in the Ghost FLUZ, trained 18 volunteers on how to do Trail Inventory, Condition Assessment, and Sustainable Trail Design, and we created and used a proposal submission and evaluation process for new trail applications which the Climbers Accessess Society has already submitted a proposal for 5.2 km of new trail to access climbs in the Ghost area. This proposal was the first through our process, and was recommended to SRD for implementation by the Ghost Stewardship Monitoring Group. We are awaiting word back from SRD on thier acceptance of this proposal. The GSMG published it's first annual report and held an open house in April of this year. As you can see, we've been busy. We are currently working on a trail plan for the NW area, and have people on the ground doing inventory, condition Assessment and Trail Design. Depending on volunteers (that means you) we are hopeful that the first new trails could begin to appear in 2009.

But, to the purpose of this message. There is much discussion about camping in the Ghost area. This is now a hot topic for both SRD and Parks, and there is support from the ministers of both of those departments to make some changes to the way camping is managed in the area and across the province as a whole. Specifically there are several problems:

Random campers sometimes leave garbage at their camp sites. There are no managed waste bins..
Random campers sometimes leave human waste at their camp sites. There are no managed outhouses.
Random campers sometimes destroy rangeland that is important for livestock and wildlife.
Random campers sometimes behave lawlessly.
Random campers are very hard to manage when they do any of the above.

The campgrounds in the area are not used to capacity.
The campgrounds in the area are closed in the Winter.
The campgrounds in the area do no fit new larger RV's such as toy haulers.
The campgrounds in the area do not facilitate the 'group camping' or 'circle the wagons experience that many people enjoy these days.
The campgrounds do not have staging areas that connect to the trails.
The campgrounds do not allow you to operate ATV's within them so you cannot legally get to the trails that are not connected to the campgrounds.

SRD and Parks are ready to invest in new campgrounds and re-designed existing campgrounds to try to alleviate some or all of those problems.

They are also talking about 'Taking the random out of random camping', to quote the line I've heard many times. One idea seems to be to build better campgrounds, but eliminate Random Camping. This is a major change to the current GAMP plan and an idea requires some feedback from YOU!

At the next GSMG meeting on October 27, the issue of random camping and campgrounds will be on the agenda. I committed to getting feedback from you for that meeting.

Some questions to ask yourself.
Why do I not like camping at campgrounds in the Ghost?
What could be done to manage some of the persistent problems with random camping?
What could be done to the campgrounds to make them appeal to you so that you would use them?

I will take all of your feedback, but positive suggestions will be more powerful than complaints. Think of solutions.

For example, my personal thoughts are that I prefer to random camp because of my dog. I don't like the on-leash rules in campgrounds, and my dog tends to bark at everyone that walks past my campground once it get's dark out. That's not pleasant for me or other campers. I like to camp well away from others for that reason. Perhaps a series of designated camp spots could be built around the region. SRD and parks would build outhouses and bear proof garbage containers, and provide free firewood at the staging areas that I can take with me, and my club would 'adopt a campspot' and maintain the outhouse and garbage can. Those are my personal thoughts.

Please feel free to post your thoughts or ideas here, or send me an e-mail with your thoughts that I will summarize and present at the meeting next week.

Thanks for your participation.

Peter Straub
[email protected]
Super Winch, 33" MT, 2 1/2" lift , CB, Flat Fender
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Offline Waytec

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2008, 10:52:31 PM »
My first thoughts on the random camping is I would use them lots more if their was out houses or out boxes at the camping locations. In Ontario I use to back county camp, canoe to the sight in the Provencal parks. It was camp by sight but people, like me just went in anyways and random camped. What they did was make some arias that are camper friendly camping sights. They where just not as nice as paid sights and place an out box in the center of the camper friendlily aria instead of one per sight. These out boxes are as they are called.  A box with a lid and a hole in the top and a pit dug under them and the waste goes their. Every so often the pit is filled in and the box is relocated. Now we had black bears but I don’t know how grizzlies are with them.
Buy putting these boxes in they where able to control indirectly where people where camping. It should work here as well. Gust have to mark where they are so people know.   
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Offline Immortal

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2008, 06:18:06 PM »
I think that the idea of a club "adopting" an area is a fantastic idea.

I like the idea of "random camping" for the privacy. Be it dogs barking, which yes, is an annoyance to everyone, including the owner, or just a group of friends that may get a little rowdy as the night wears on. Not being able to see the neighbouring campers will be a big influence to end random camping, in my opinion...

T
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Offline JasonL_031

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2008, 08:16:33 PM »
random camping is all i do i hate being close to people when i camp i camp to get away from the masses. and i take my camper where every my truck can go :D
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Offline sylvrinvader

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2008, 08:07:44 PM »
same thoughts for me and free fire wood not $10 for a little bag that lasts 30min
03 TJ, 33" BFG's,4:88 gears  BBoost, CB, custom front bumper,  insta/extenda trunks, rugged ridge roof rack w/basket

Offline big black dodge

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2008, 10:21:36 PM »
2 solutions that i can think off are:
1) gated roads - you have to pay to have a key for access to offroading, camping, quading, etc.  I know me and my buddies have no problem paying if it helps to fund keeping the areas open
2) what about paid random access - you pay for a camping permit, but can camp in designated random access areas.  help pay for facilities in those areas.
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Offline murdajeep

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2008, 11:22:55 PM »
I agree with the pay to camp/wheel/ride/quad but I would like to see that money actually being spent in the area on up keep of the trails and not just thrown into some other project that has nothing to do with recreational use in Alberta.  That is what always frustrated me is that I have to register my Dirt Bike and the money is suspose to go into maintaining the land so that it will be there to use...well at least that is what they said when they made registration manditory for all OHV.

I am getting tired of all the shanagans, and with the land being taken away from us to wheel on all I had was random camping left that I could do responsibly in the back country and now with them trying so tighten that up makes me want to stick with the Dirt Bike, sell the Jeep and buy a sled.

And I agree I only go random camping because to be all far I hate camping so close to a person that you can see what they are making for meals.  And If a few buddies and I go out for the weekend and have a few woabably pops by the fire ya we do get loud but we do it responsibly but I don't want to be waking a family sleeping in there Winnebago at 3 in the morning.

Just my 2 cents.
Murdajeep

91 YJ 4.0L 3.0" Suspension Lift  1.25" Body Lift with Mickey Thompsons MTZ 33's and a champion winch, Ford 8.8, 4.10 Gears

D.Hoali

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Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2009, 09:04:26 AM »
Ron   Thank you for putting this together  Very well organized, and I know I could not have done better, hehe  If you do not mind, I would like to pass your info around, please let me know if that is ok. 

Thanks again

Offline Ostego

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2009, 10:19:28 AM »
random camping is all i do i hate being close to people when i camp i camp to get away from the masses. and i take my camper where every my truck can go :D

Me as well, I go camping to get away from people and the further I can get away from others the better!
I stay away from camp sites for that reason among others (who wants to pay for wood and to camp and smell crap from an out house?) I go as far as my vehicle can possibly take me and have been doing so since I was very young when my parents would take me and do the exact same thing.

I agree some people abuse the random camping and have HUGE unruly parties...leave garbage, human refuse ext. drive off trails and anywhere they please, which is a shame because it ruins it for everyone else. Every time I go out for a weekend I usually end up bringing back bags upon bags of garbage I have collected from the area...and when I return some weeks later the same amount of garbage is STILL around.
Pack out what you pack in! ::)



On a side note, the amount of beer cans I collect from camp sites usually helps pay for my gas! :P
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Offline frenchy

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2009, 10:32:03 AM »
SRD and Parks are ready to invest in new campgrounds and re-designed existing campgrounds to try to alleviate some or all of those problems.

A year has now gone by, any updates on what and where the "investment " is?
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Offline Asia

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2009, 10:42:05 AM »
I enjoy random camping for a few reasons:  

*privacy - away from others, stay up late around the fire.
*freedom to choose where I camp - location for shelter, sun, views, close to a babbling brook...
*access to firewood.
*low cost (free) - I would rather not pay $24-30 per tent/site per night, we pay enough taxes and fees for  everything else, we are paying for Waiparous and McLean through our taxes.

To sustain continued random camping:

*practice low impact camping - choose a location that will have little or no trace of your visit, or a campsite that is already established with a fire pit.
*take only only dead fall/dead standing wood and only what you need for your fire.  Have a small fire, not a bonfire.
*pack out ALL your garbage including wrappers, bottle caps, cigarette butts etc.  Don't throw any garbage in your fire.
*taking a crap (bowel movement) - dig a hole 1-2 feet deep, take your crap in it, fill the hole back in.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2009, 10:48:03 AM by Asia »
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Offline SwampSinger

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2009, 05:11:08 PM »
A year has now gone by, any updates on what and where the "investment " is?


It's the government dude... when they say a year they mean a decade ;D

Offline Hi Lo Silver

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2009, 06:28:21 PM »
Man don't get me started again. :D ::)

Offline SwampSinger

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2009, 06:42:52 PM »

Offline Spinalguy

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Re: Random Camping in the Ghost FLUZ
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2009, 07:12:40 PM »
Actually, the government has acted. They posted BIG billboard signs stating no random camping for a 15km distance(or close to that, i can't remember exact) that is basically where all the random camping spots were.
Hunter Valley is now the closest random camping legally.
Yay! not.:(
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