FJ Cruiser

[JasonL_031]

no this is the ultimate 4 wheeler lol or should it be called a 6 wheeler  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:






                   

[Bnine]

are you serious? i would tear that tin can up in a minute  :twisted:

You know what? Your Jeep may outwheel a Toyota but it can't even dream about outlasting it.

How and where Vince?

You yourself have posted the vehicle efficiency article, with studies proving wranglers are near the top over all.

What on a yota out lasts our wranglers?

Lets realistically weigh it out.

Differentials. The old ones, absolutely. The new ones, good luck.

Motors. Easily a tie, or a close win by the 4.0. The 4 litre is as old as toy itself, and they are wellknown to last just as long as any PoS 20, or 22r, the more common yota motor used off roaders. Todays todays, who knows, neither has been around 30 years to say.

Body. Hands down, jeep. Yota, honda, nissan, doesnt matter, all their body's rust to all to heck.

Tranny and t-case. Easy toss ups between years and models. Fj years are stout units, but bulky, heavy, and difficult to get parts for. Rubi t-case is probably the best dealer offered case to ever go into a vehicle, although gear driven fans will argue agaisnt it. The dana 300 even came in some yota's.

Ironically the longest lasting jeep tranny ever was the japanese built AW4 though:P Figured I better add that one in there    

I see more old jeeps on the road then yota's.

I see more yota's with the body prematurely falling apart then jeeps.

I can order, and build any jeep model body, including tub, windsheild, and fenders for 1700$.

Yota's, you end up with a flat deck.

Will the yota's of today outlast the jeeps of today. Maybe. But stating that like its some rule of thumb is near sited IMO.

We'll see how the 4 jk compares. With the exception of the lame v6, It seems fairly stout. I dont see the FJ sporting a 32 spline high pinion dana 44.

Personally I dont like them. And I do like old cruisers. Nothing about the new one really says cruiser to me.

Hopefully it improves.

[gsxtacy]

             

bnine, that's awesome!

and mine's not even a new wrangler.....

dana 44's will outlast the toothpick axles on the yota

with the right parts, a 4.2 can blow the sox off of any i-6 or v-6.  

you can't go wrong with the classic looks of an old fire-breather ( 2a, 3a, 3b or 5a/b) mines rusted, just surface rust and the back corners like all the yj's and fj's and anything else which has graceful ( see square  :lol: ) lines.

dana 300 twin stick is prolly the best stocker t-case out there ( where in? JEEP!)

my t-150's been through a couplea rebuilds, the peugot tranny in the newer xj's are junk, so it evens out

...old jeeps rock, and you can't put a flat deck on the back  (unless it's a J 20, 30, 3000, 4000 or an fc)

yotas are great trucks, i am gunna get a hilux surf to go around in, drive the jeep when it's warm, it's an equal balance.  


old cruisers rok, new cruiser's sock.

and jason...that LAVitory is junk... gets stuck in anything because it weighs 12 tons.
 :roll:

jeeps don't take too much to have a locker installed, and it's cheaper than having the monkeys in the dealership do it (ooo...scratches head)

i was out 4x4ing on lost knife ( i think...47-51-87-91-126-out)  in waiparous and we came across a cruiser (new fj) mired (see horibly low clearance) on some ruts.   it was a nice try, he had it all locked up too.  


End Note...  
The FJ is for the yuppies, much like the h2 & 3 are.  the only time they'll ever be in 4 low is when the winters come around and lawyer joe needs something to get out of his drifted up driveway.  you may come across the odd jacked up FJ in a 4x4 rag, but that's the small majority of them who are crazy enough ( and have enough electronical exp.) to mess around with new age parts.  the jeep (wrangler rubicon) is still the best outta the box north american 4x4 for getting into - and out of, tough spots.


i've seen it and until i see a fj fording 3 food deep h2o, my opinion stands.

[SteveO]

Some good points Bill but look at the total package and not just one part from one against another.  Consider quality, reliabilty and the way the vehicles are meant to be used etc.  

There is no comparison between a 40 and a CJ.  40 hands down.

There is no comparison between a gen 1 or 2 4runner and a cherokee. 4Runner hands down.  

Jeep truck vs Toyota trucks?  No comparison.

There is no comparison between a 60 and a wagoneer.  

Toyota makes powerful, reliable, fuel efficient engines that will routinely hit 500 000km with out a rebuild.  There's a reason you won't find a jeep in the middle of a desert in Africa, the middle east or in the outback of Austraila.  

I admit Jeep is the last company still producing a vehicle (for North America) that's meant for offroad with solid axles etc but I still wouldn't buy one.  :lol:   I'd do the extra work and import a 70 series LC with lockers, solid axles and a Toyota diesel. ....Steve

[gsxtacy]

this is not a toyota board.  a Kaiser 715 WILL run a little flat-decked toy into the ground, i will put money on it.

that's all they are after all are toys.  yes, they make fuel efficient, reliable engines, putting power into the mix isn't real on a little tiny 22r.  

AMC 360 or a hemi in a CJ or wrangler made just as much, if not loads more power as well as being just as reliable.

i will also put money on the fact that the Golden Eagle or the Renegade edition of the CJ's will destroy any stocker fj offroad.  and the only reason why you don't see jeeps down there is not because of the durability factor, our money is expensive down and out there.   i have also seen plenty of jeeps hit 500 k, so it's a moot point.  you're comparing the real with the fake.  

the runner is better, because there's not much to compare them to, but other than that, you are looking at a true 4x4 (rubi or cj) and a yuppie magnet (FJ cruiser)

i know my cj will stand up to any abuse i want to throw at it.
and if you wanna pour 50 into it to do just what i can for only 5 then go ahead, i'll be at the top of the hill waiting for you, but until i have 5 to do what i want, ima goin' ta bed.

[SteveO]

 a Kaiser 715 WILL run a little flat-decked toy into the ground, i will put money on it.

The Kaiser is a military truck with limited production.  Why not compare similar vehicles and see how that works out.  

Want to talk about power?  Look at the 4L engines from both companies and see how they compare in HP and torque?  Wonder which will last longer?

[SteveO]

and if you wanna pour 50 into it to do just what i can for only 5 then go ahead, i'll be at the top of the hill waiting for you, but until i have 5 to do what i want, ima goin' ta bed.

Not sure what this means?

[gsxtacy]

ok, first off, you'll never get the hp rating from a 22r that you will from a 360, 304 or 302 i-6 (mine's bored & stroked) the torque from the diesel may be a little more comprabe, but naturally aspirated, it has no hopes of making enough power to spin big tires thru the mud.  you also have to look at fuels, compression ratios, and all of the other junk that gets thrown on them. i think it'llcome out about the same. there's no replacement 4 displacement

ok...let's not compare the 715, but the J 3000, made by kaiser for the american market.  that's easily the most rugged production pickup ever built for the american market in my mind, and will still cook the little toy.


pour 50 grand into your toy (including price), i'll throw another 5 into mine and we'll wheel, i bet it'll be me at the top of the hill.

[SteveO]

ok, first off, you'll never get the hp rating from a 22r that you will from a 360, 304 or 302 i-6 (mine's bored & stroked) the torque from the diesel may be a little more comprabe, but naturally aspirated, it has no hopes of making enough power to spin big tires thru the mud.  you also have to look at fuels, compression ratios, and all of the other junk that gets thrown on them. i think it'llcome out about the same.

pour 50 grand into your toy (including price), i'll throw another 5 into mine and we'll wheel, i bet it'll be me at the top of the hill.

You're comparing 4cyl to a 6 again.  I'll put the Toy 4cyl against the Jeep 4cyl any day though.

You can't be serious about your 5 and 50 grand thing?  I don't even know what you drive but I'd bet you wouldn't be waiting for me at the top of any hill as my truck sits now.

[gsxtacy]

toy= toyota

 

just to clarify...and i know about the little 4 bangers, i just like big engines, and i also find it hard that you can only get 150 hp out of an efi engine at insanely high revs (5800?!)... what went wrong there?   torque on the 22r ( not even 22r anymore...3rzfe) isn't that great either...a whomping 177 lb/ft. (at 4 grand, another unreasonably high rev number)

jeep: wrangler

2.4 hp output = 147@3200
2.4 tq output= 185@3200

IMO the numbers speek for themselves, i pulled these offa the web, so they're prolly fuddled a little, but it looks like the jeep engine has more to it.  now...as for high mileage stuff... if you take proper care of it, it'll last.  if you don't it dosent. plain and simple.

[kevman]

To each his own.

Personally the new FJ doesn't do it for me.  I love the old ones, FJ's, BJ's, Trucks they're all great vehicles.  If I were in the market for a new pickup today it'd be a Tacoma.

I'd question your claim that the toyota always wins "hands down".  Apples to apples I've spent some time behind the wheel of a similar 4runner to my grand and I'd take my grand, not just cause I already own it.  Both with 31's mine has better street manners, more room, better flex and ALOT more power.  It's true that I've put money into it and the 4runner was stock but when you consider that the price of a new grand plus the stuff I've put into it is the same price as just the runner that is a non factor.  As for reliability, my fuel pump just burn't up after 13 years and the water pump quit after 9 besides that it's been all regular maintance and fixing.  With proper maintance I'm told 300k miles easy on the 318 which at my pace means I've got 30 more years.  Realistically that's not the case so we'll see.

Apples to apples, an FJ beats a Liberty hands down...
Apples to apples, toyota offers NOTHING today to compete with the Wrangler...
Apples to apples, toyota offers NOTHING today to compete with the SRT8 Grand...
Apples to apples, you can't compare the efficiency of the two...I sometimes wish my 318 had japanese efficiency but at least it's got american rumble :roll:

You want to talk all around performance...

Bling, Bling!

Seriously though, the Toyota vs. Jeep thing is played...both have their merits and along with Land Rover all 3 share a storied past of good, reliable 4x4's...you just won't ever get a Toy guy to admit it.  

Chevy vs. Ford...
(OK, that's a no brainer...Mopar...)

[SteveO]

jeep: wrangler

2.4 hp output = 147@3200
2.4 tq output= 185@3200

IMO the numbers speek for themselves,

These are the numbers for the Toy 4cyl.  I guess they do speak for themselves.

Horsepower  - 159
 Torque - 180

[gsxtacy]

steve...those numbers are at unrealistically high revs for a 4 banger...they prolly set it up on the dyno and got those # just before it threw a rod.  

i've been trying to tell you that each to his own, i think my jeep will kick the nutz off of any toyota, and you're a die hard toyota fan obviously...

kevinator's statement is right.

[Bnine]

There is no comparison between a 40 and a CJ.  40 hands down.

....Steve

How so Steve? CJ's came with smallblocks as an option, 40's were one of the first yota's to have sbc conversion kits built for them. To mimic the CJ.

40 drivetrain while strong, is rare, and hard to get parts for.

The CJ dana 300 is one of the most popular t-cases ever built, and a large part of the atlas design basis stems from those dana cases.

A dana 44 rear end was a CJ option as well. Comparible quality to the toy 8.25.

The CJ front dana 30 does lack, but the yota front comes with its own headaches, namely the Birfeild.

There is more aftermarket for the CJ then the 40, making for more competition and lower prices. Not that the 40 isnt well supplied with aftermarket, it just isnt as popular.

In my humble opinion, there isnt really any hands down about, both have ups and downs, and it boils down to preference.

Runner versus XJ. There's an old arguement. Basically you have 2 choices. Underpowered on a solid drivetrain. Or well powered on a so so drivetrain depending on year.

An xj with a 44 rear, hp30, 231 case, and ax 15 is just about as sound a drivetrain as a runner but not grossly underpowered.

With the runner you still have the problem of birfs, and only 1 year of solid front axle with efi.

Again, ups and downs.

Will the new JK rubi be able to keep up with the new cruiser in soccer mom standards? Probably not. But generally thats not what we are here to discuss. Hands down the new JK will out offroad any other production vehicle out of the box.

If we were looking for the best grocery getter then this discussion is moot, because I wouldnt buy either one.

I'd put my wife an kids in some mitsubishy, or korean suv that comes with a 10 year, 175,000km warrenty, with more bells, whistles, options, and all for less money then the "cool" 4x4's we are comparing.

[apex]

finnaly, some good debate on this forum!

Seriously, this is great.