Calgary Jeep Association
General Forums => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: RUBICON13 on January 30, 2012, 07:45:00 AM
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I am sure this topic has been debated until the cows come home and I have discussed it with several people myself but, I want to state my experience and ask the question once again...
So, I know synthetic is much easier to handle and I believe does not need the attention to get spooled back up properly as steel does. However, in the six months I have been wheeling, I have seen 2 synthetic lines brake. On the positive side, they did as advertised and simply dropped to the ground without taking anyone's head off. So, is it just coincidence that I have witenssed two brake in such a short period of time or does synthetic have a weakness? Yes, I also know you can re-attach it (if you know how) on the trail.
This past weekend I saw steel wire not get spooled up properly and thus was unable to get it fixed on the trail to work again (spool in and out properly). But, as long as it was spooled up properly it worked (yes, with some tugging and pulling up and down hill). I also witnessed a person guiding the wire in as the winch was being used in order to make sure it spolled properly. This didn't seem like the safest thing to do but, is it necessary to keep the winch working?
So, my ultimate question is: synthetic or steel and why...? I realize it may be personal preference but, I am interested in hearing everyone's opinon and experience before I make my decision.
Thanks,
Jeff
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No personal experience here, but...
In my mind, the safety factor trumps all. When I get a winch it will have synthetic.
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Lots of pros and cons on this topic. I went with steel line cause we have chinnooks here. Chances are what happened to those other lines was water melted , settled in and on the line and refrooze , damaging the strands. Now my jeep gets parked outside and till this week is , was a daily driver thus exposing it to the daily freeze thaw cycle. Now if I parked mine indoors in a garage and was not a daily driver it would have synthetic.
Yes you have to wind up the winch line to make it reasonably straight and yes you have to man handle it with leather gloves and be carefull.
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Water in your winch line that freezes will not kill synthetic. Mine has gotten wet and gotten frozen a few times, and still hasn't broken on me....and it wasn't even new when I got it. Synthetic that is installed properly and used properly is STRONGER for a given diameter than steel. If you do bugger things up and allow it to get damaged - not a problem. You can splice it right there on the trail with a piece of wire, a pair of scissors, and a sharpie marker. If you want to keep the road grime off of it, then just get a cover for your winch.
I've spent far too much time hauling steel cable to think it's fun. Give me synthetic and a couple tools so that I can splice it any day.
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Synthetic line does not like UV. Keep it out of the sun.
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Synthetic line does not like UV. Keep it out of the sun.
Amsteel Blue was originally designed for the harsh marine enviroment. While it's colour fades quickly, UV does not otherwise effect it.
I ran 5/16 Amsteel on my XD9000 for 4 years with only one breakage. At least a hundred pulls before it broke.
My current Jeep will also use Amsteel but this time I'll go with 3/8".
IMO, the safety factor far outweighs any negative.
Vince
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Just get a proper size and you will be good. 5/16" line is too small for any winch outside of an ATV. 3/8" for up to 9500 lb winches, 7/16" for 12000 lb. Replace or remove any damaged sections and you will never see a breakage. Clean it and dry with water when dirty.
It is so much easier to use.
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I've used steel since I started wheeling and i'm switching my lines to synthetic because of safety.
Steel cables scare the crap out of me ....
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i,ve been off roading for 30yrs now.Ive always had wire cable and yup sometimes its a pain in the butt to re -spool and drag out.My son had synthetic rope , he kept a cover over it t0 protect it from the sun etc.I really liked it as its light and easy to carry etc.Buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut it was not very durable abrasion wise and was expensive.I think its unusual to break it,wonder why?Safety- wise yup synthetic rope is better.Now that I,ve told u what i think it probably doesn,t help you much eh? At least I can tell u my experiences.what do i have? i have wire rope/cable. if i had the money i would do synthetic just for the ease of it even if it didnt last as long
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Thanks everyone for your replies. I guess this debate is sort of like the chicken and the egg...no real right answer; just personal preference (with some good reasons to prefer each).
I guess I am thinking that a winch is something great to have if you need it. But, it has been my experience that it is not needed a lot. So, I am tending to lean towards steel since I don't see myself using it too often (so hauling it around when I need it may not be that bad) but, when it is needed it may be more reliable. However, I agree with the advantage of safety for synthetic. But, it seems if you place something over the steel cable when using it it significantly reduces the safety issue with it breaking. Bottom line: when I need a winch I want it to work. Now, I just need to figure out what make of winch...LOL (Warn vs. Kingone at this point)
Thanks again,
Jeff
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kingone, comes with synthetic line so solves both problems at once - you don't have to be the one with the frayed and kinked steel line that everyone has to hide from behind trees and drag up hills .... because you wanted to save $100.00
as for durabilty, just as easy to put a jacket or something under the synthetic as it is to put something on top of a steel line. there is no downside to synthetic.
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Go with a WARN.
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No real concern if you happen to drag a wire rope across the odd rock or log....synthetic not at all without a sleeve of some sort for protection.
Precautions need to be taken for heating up the synthetic on the drum.
Your fairlead needs to be perfectly flawless for synthetic.
Cost factor. You could replace a wire rope every year for four years cheaper than buying a synthetic which you'd also have to replace as often.
As far as being that one that chases people to hiding when you're winching. So what. If you think I'll be standing around any cable when someone is winching you're mistaken. I'll give you the safty concern synthetic verses wire but I still won't be standing around close by unless I'm the one feeding the line.
I've been running 150' of 5/16's for years with no problems. Surprizing how often you need that last 50' when you're stuck sometimes.
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i am with you Gun^.
Steel has never let me down and i have never seen a steel cable break/snap. i have never seen a close call ever while winching with steel. i did see a trailer ball launched like a missile one summer at Johnson Bog, luckily no one was hurt and the idiot that hooked up, did it with very few (other than his group) knowing. i caught it happen at the last second.
Gotta be on your toes back in the heydays of Johnson Bog ;D
i will continue to run steel unless i win some rope at the show and shine. ;)
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Had a tilt deck trailer where I worked that a 8000# Warn on it for pulling loads up. The guys kept binding the cable up from sucking it up with no load/tension on the wire. Talked the boss into putting some synthetic on, I think it lasted maybe a month. I figure they must have been dragging the rope across the deck and wore it out.
I might try it on my rig where I know to be careful with it but I'm not going to bother with it for any work/fleet vehicle again.
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i am with you Gun^.
Steel has never let me down and i have never seen a steel cable break/snap. i have never seen a close call ever while winching with steel. i did see a trailer ball launched like a missile one summer at Johnson Bog, luckily no one was hurt and the idiot that hooked up, did it with very few (other than his group) knowing. i caught it happen at the last second.
Gotta be on your toes back in the heydays of Johnson Bog ;D
i will continue to run steel unless i win some rope at the show and shine. ;)
Now that does sound familiar! Any chance you remember that ball hitch flying out of a charcoal cherokee? lol. My buddy bent his hitch to crap so we yanked it with my winch right beside the bog. That was different though... used a snatch block and aimed er away from the people ;-) That place was definately the beginning of the end up there.
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Now that does sound familiar! Any chance you remember that ball hitch flying out of a charcoal cherokee? lol. My buddy bent his hitch to crap so we yanked it with my winch right beside the bog. That was different though... used a snatch block and aimed er away from the people ;-) That place was definately the beginning of the end up there.
it was a pic up truck and no precautions were taken...
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No real concern if you happen to drag a wire rope across the odd rock or log....synthetic not at all without a sleeve of some sort for protection.
Precautions need to be taken for heating up the synthetic on the drum
Both of these concerns are not a problem with a kingone TDS line winch. The line comes with a sleeve and there is no heat in the drum with its cone style brake in fact it is the only true built for synthetic line winch on the market.
And UV rays do not damage the line but will fade the color.
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Thanks everyone for your replies. I guess this debate is sort of like the chicken and the egg...no real right answer; just personal preference (with some good reasons to prefer each).
Jeff, heres a kicker for you ;)
if you're gonna go wheelin, and get stuck, and go on a few 'winch fests' then synthetic is VERY nice to have............... for the GUY PULLING YOUR LINE!
once upon a time, at an unmentioned place somewhere i had to pull line for some president's silver rubicon cause he decided he didn't wanna play 'roll the Rubicon'. now, the weather sucked. it was raining nonstop. we were on a steep hill. a slippery, steep hill.
now, i'm not the most athletic member, i admit, but I/we could barely walk up this hill, let alone yank 100' of steel cable up it. however, that silver rubi had synthetic, and i could haul that line up that slippery slope.
so long story short, i thinkg 100% if you can afford the synthetic, go for it. when you have to spool it out and in, its 100% easier than the heavy steel line....... and us more 'husky' gentlemen will appreciate it all the more!
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for the GUY PULLING YOUR LINE!
I have so many responses to that comment :o :o :o
You don't really appreciate synthetic line until you unspool 40 or 50 feet and then toss it up a hill for somebody else to catch and hook up.
Vince
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I have so many responses to that comment :o :o :o
You don't really appreciate synthetic line until you unspool 40 or 50 feet and then toss it up a hill for somebody else to catch and hook up.
Vince
its been so long since i've had my line pulled............. gettin married you know ;)
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Fixed it for you.
once upon a time, at an unmentioned place somewhere i handed the line to some poor soul, who then proceeded to haul the line up the remainder of the hill for some president's silver rubicon cause he decided he didn't wanna play 'roll the Rubicon'. now, the weather sucked. it was raining nonstop. we were on a steep hill. a slippery, steep hill.
now, i'm not the most athletic member, i admit.