Calgary Jeep Association
4x4 Related Groups => General Talk => Topic started by: Vinman on September 25, 2006, 07:07:18 AM
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I took one out for a test drive and all I can say is it is a sweet ride. Good ride, power and unbelievably quiet at highway speeds.
It has about the same cargo area behind the rear seats as my TJ does with the rear seats removed.
Tempting..............
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We looked at them when we decided we need a bigger family mobile for the two kids and all the junk that goes with them. I really like them but they didn't have any more rear seat room or storage space in the back for strollers etc. You should buy it though. ...Steve
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I knew this post would lure you out of hiding...
I'm thinking about it.........
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They do look pretty sweet with 35's.
(http://www.spydercustoms.com/bytes/UA2006/UAFJ1LG.jpg)
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I knew this post would lure you out of hiding...
I'm thinking about it.........
We ended up taking the ultimate plunge and bought a minivan for the family vehicle. The FJ Cruiser is nice but it didn't offer any real advantages over my wife's CRV as far as space etc. Offroad manners weren't high on her criteria list. I'm sure you'd love it though. ...Steve
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I'm sure you'd love it though. ...Steve
My biggest problem is I don't NEED it, I ust WANT it. :D
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are you serious? i would tear that tin can up in a minute :twisted:
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are you serious? i would tear that tin can up in a minute :twisted:
Are you serious? That truck is probably the best mix of offroad worthy, street ability and quality built vehicles available on the market. It already has incredible aftermarket support, will hold it's value and is built by the best automaker in the business. What vehicle in it's price range can compare to it? ......Steve
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um.... old FJ's will work just as well, have INCREDIBLE oem & aftermarket support, classic looks and handling (i'll give you that steve), and if you are lucky enough can get one in diesel, with dana 44s and a dana 300 twin stick. although it is built by the 2nd best automaker in the world, it will do just fine...and for about 10-20 grand, low kms, rhd who can argue?
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are you serious? i would tear that tin can up in a minute :twisted:
You know what? Your Jeep may outwheel a Toyota but it can't even dream about outlasting it.
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ya, i know, and i don't plan on it either, it'll be a "survivor" with low original mi. :) and vin...you've prolly heard the shpeal about regular care & maintenance etc...
i'm actually planning on getting a newer hilux out of japan to be my work truck, as toyota truly currently builds the best all around 4x4's in the world, and i'll give them that. :P
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um.... old FJ's will work just as well, have INCREDIBLE oem & aftermarket support, classic looks and handling (i'll give you that steve), and if you are lucky enough can get one in diesel, with dana 44s and a dana 300 twin stick. although it is built by the 2nd best automaker in the world, it will do just fine...and for about 10-20 grand, low kms, rhd who can argue?
I know about the old FJ's bu thtat has nothing to do with the new FJ cruiser, which really isn't a Land Cruiser at all. FJ40's are not nice to drive on the road, get lousy mileage and have very few OEM parts still available.
The old ones are appealing for a different reason but are not a reasonable choice for a daily driver and certainly aren't in the same category as the FJ Cruiser.
If Toyota is the second best automaker, who's the first?
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it depends what you're going for... if it's the 4x4s, then it's mercedes (unimog), if it's quality, then it's ferrari, if it's mass production, then it's gm. etc. i'm looking @ quality & 4x4ability...sure a properly built one could outwheel anything but yota can't hold a candle to unimog's hand built quality. albeit, there's not going to be 900 000 km mog's, either.
steve, why does it have a name like fj cruiser? what happens when those tailight lenses get caught on a rock? they break...oh, guess what...they're only made in japan? oh no... it'll cost 200 buxx for one to get shipped here? oh my... :P
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it depends what you're going for? if it's the 4x4s, then it's yota, if it's quality, then it's ferrari, if it's mass production, then it's gm. etc. i'm looking @ quality. yota can't hold a candle to ferrari's hand built quality, albeit, there's not going to be 900 000 km ferraris, either.
I'm not positive because I don't have any interest in Ferrari but I don't think they build anything even close to an FJC. Probably nothing within a 100K of one either so I don't think they really factor in to this thread.
The point of the thread is the FJ Cruiser and you're saying you'd tear it up in a minute. What comparable vehicle is a better purchase that would out-perform it as a depenable, streetable, off-road vehicle? Unlikely that there is one that does even close to as good in all areas. .....Steve
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let me tell you something steve...that pic is the second one i've ever seen of an fjc in a set of tires and a lift. and i'll give you the fact that it's an all-around great vehicle, but the quality is not there... when i testdrove one (first month or so they came out), it was pretty rattly and plastickie (sp?) but how many have actually been built for the wilderness? i thought they were geared for the yuppie crowd. if i had 60 grand, i'd mod it too, maybe.
yes it is drivable, yes, it looks pretty cool, but imo they could've done more justice to the fj name.
and why'd they hafta call it a cruiser...it sounds like another crysler product that i'd dear not mention the name. :evil:
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steve, why does it have a name like fj cruiser? what happens when those tailight lenses get caught on a rock? they break...oh, guess what...they're only made in japan? oh no... it'll cost 200 buxx for one to get shipped here? oh my... :P
The name is a throw back to the old Cruisers where it got it's styling from but it's not called a "Land Cruiser". Toyota still makes a Land Cruiser and it's a very different vehicle. You won't find many Cruiserheads that like them compared to the older FJ's either.
As for the tail lights, I imagine that with any other vehicle when you break a light, you replace it. I've been on the trail and have seen more than 1 TJ lose it's light on a tree. I guess that's one of the reasons the LED light install is a popular mod on the Jeeps. It also turns out they actually stock parts for these vehicles sold in NA right here on the continent.
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that's a plus.
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and if you want something comparable, although there's tons of them around, try the xterra. lotsa cargo space, quite a bit of aftermarket stuff, (if you know where to look) and some comforts that make hauling the kids around quite enjoyable (torquey v-6(good on gas)) and they cost quite a bit less too.
check it out: http://autos.msn.com/research/compare/default.aspx?c=0&n=3&i=0&tb=0&ph1=t0&ph2=t0&dt=0&v=t102545&v=t102312
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and if you want something comparable, although there's tons of them around, try the xterra. lotsa cargo space, quite a bit of aftermarket stuff, (if you know where to look) and some comforts that make hauling the kids around quite enjoyable (torquey v-6(good on gas)) and they cost quite a bit less too.
check it out: http://autos.msn.com/research/compare/default.aspx?c=0&n=3&i=0&tb=0&ph1=t0&ph2=t0&dt=0&v=t102545&v=t102312
So you think an Xterra is better than the 'yota?
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The Xterra was best 4X4 of the year for the last couple years in Car and Driver or similar mag.
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I cant believe that anyone on this site would promote the "FJ"!! (Foreign Jeep, Fake Jeep, F@#$ed-up Jeep) Just remember what boys in the hood say... "Jeep in, Jeep out."
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h8er just said it...out of the box, absolutely! i think it is a great 4x4, it holds it's value the same (both japanese companies), has more power, more grnd clearance, a tighter turning radius, more cargo room, etc... Nissan did it right when they designed this, and it really shows. Motortrend and Cn'D both gave this the truck of the year, motortrend's a few years running. i c where ur coming from with the FJ. in some respects, it's a great truck. i just think that there are better alternatives to be found elsewhere (i mean, for like 12 grand, you can import a used hilux surf. nothing is proven tougher than a hilux :D )
and for us that don't need a lot of family room to go overland with, the jeep is still the best choice
pig, that's funny stuff! :lol:
i mean, what would a legend be if not built on silly acronyms such as
Just Empty Every Pocket
Just Eats Every Part
Jump Excitedly in Every Pothole
Jumps Everything Ever Parked
Joint Emergency Evacuation Plan
it's a freakin' legend, and there's nothing that can stop it, whilist the japanese work on their own:
Nasty Import Sucks Savings Away to Nippon
Taking Our Yen Out -- Thanks All
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and if you want something comparable, although there's tons of them around, try the xterra. lotsa cargo space, quite a bit of aftermarket stuff, (if you know where to look) and some comforts that make hauling the kids around quite enjoyable (torquey v-6(good on gas)) and they cost quite a bit less too.
check it out: http://autos.msn.com/research/compare/default.aspx?c=0&n=3&i=0&tb=0&ph1=t0&ph2=t0&dt=0&v=t102545&v=t102312
I had to put the girls to bed but now I'm back. Miss me? :wink:
Nissan's don't hold their values anywhere near as well as a Honda or Toyota. They're not as popular new or used. Better than a Mazda but not as good as the other two. I like the X-Terra and loved driving the Supercharged 5 speed but wouldn't consider it as good as the FJ. The FJC has an available locker, more power and stronger build. The X-terra is great but won't hold up as well offroad in stock form. You'll also have a tougher time finding aftermarket lifts, armour and other accesories for it.
As for pics, there are lots of FJC's that are already lifted and getting used like they were designed to. Some more than they should have.
(http://www.allprooffroad.com/images/stories/fj_rock_guard_action.jpg)
(http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/7916/allprofjpostgt4.jpg)
(http://minitruckchics.com/Offroad/OnandOffroad_9_15_2006/dsc00186.jpg)
Here's a couple reviews and comparisons of FJC's vs. X-terra's.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suv/112_0604_midsize_suv_comparison/2007_toyota_fj_cruiser.html
And a video. http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/ViewModelDetail/make=Toyota/model=FJ%20Cruiser#1
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I cant believe that anyone on this site would promote the "FJ"!! (Foreign Jeep, Fake Jeep, F@#$ed-up Jeep) Just remember what boys in the hood say... "Jeep in, Jeep out."
The J in FJ has nothing to do with Jeep although that's a common misconception. The F stands for the engine type, the J is for the country built (Japan) and the 40 or other number stands for the body series.
Why not promote a member to buy the best vehicle out there? That's why nobody has stepped up and suggested a Liberty. :shock:
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The Xterra was best 4X4 of the year for the last couple years in Car and Driver or similar mag.
:roll: The FJC is new this year and wasn't eligible. See who wins it this year. ...Steve
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I think Nissan spoiled the Xterra with the recent redesign. Too big in my opinion. I really liked the first generation X's.
Vince
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ya the past x was good... and w/e each to his own, this is all just opinions, right?
i still think it's junk, like all of the "cruiserheads" and half of the jeep guys.
and now a days, there's plenty of armour and stuff avail...also, why'd my mom get ~20 grand back from the dealer (2k5) from a 96 pathfinder se with broken windshield, clutch chatter and blinking airbag light when it was bought new for ~40?
o god, more pics of that monstrosity :evil: i'm about to gouge my own eyes out :P :P :P :P RAZZZZ
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You guys don't know what you're talking about ....
This is the ultimate 4X4...
(http://users.pandora.be/skelter/skelter/skelters/2/skelterii5_6x4.jpg)
(http://www.ladausa.net/images/niva2/niva_ext_5.jpg)
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: ... Ok I'm going to bed....
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WHOOOOO!!! NIVA!!! i had one of those when i was 14... put 35s under it and broke the axles going down the highway @ 80 kliks because the i-4 wouldn't drive me any faster. i've seen some pretty amazing things done with those 4x4s out in russia. they run a snow race in eastern siberia, 500 mi long, ~6 times as treacharous and harsh as the baja 1000, that was fun to watch.
(http://www.superjamie.net/garage/4x4-lada-niva.jpg)
you win...ima goin 2 bed
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I was looking at this guy too, and each time one is next to my GC I have to compare... but it does seem like it has great ground clearnece, and I love the fact you can get a locker factory installed.
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no this is the ultimate 4 wheeler lol or should it be called a 6 wheeler :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
(http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/3/web/2103000-2103999/2103630_61_full.jpg)
(http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/3/web/2103000-2103999/2103630_62_full.gif)
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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are you serious? i would tear that tin can up in a minute :twisted:
You know what? Your Jeep may outwheel a Toyota but it can't even dream about outlasting it.
How and where Vince?
You yourself have posted the vehicle efficiency article, with studies proving wranglers are near the top over all.
What on a yota out lasts our wranglers?
Lets realistically weigh it out.
Differentials. The old ones, absolutely. The new ones, good luck.
Motors. Easily a tie, or a close win by the 4.0. The 4 litre is as old as toy itself, and they are wellknown to last just as long as any PoS 20, or 22r, the more common yota motor used off roaders. Todays todays, who knows, neither has been around 30 years to say.
Body. Hands down, jeep. Yota, honda, nissan, doesnt matter, all their body's rust to all to heck.
Tranny and t-case. Easy toss ups between years and models. Fj years are stout units, but bulky, heavy, and difficult to get parts for. Rubi t-case is probably the best dealer offered case to ever go into a vehicle, although gear driven fans will argue agaisnt it. The dana 300 even came in some yota's.
Ironically the longest lasting jeep tranny ever was the japanese built AW4 though:P Figured I better add that one in there :D :D
I see more old jeeps on the road then yota's.
I see more yota's with the body prematurely falling apart then jeeps.
I can order, and build any jeep model body, including tub, windsheild, and fenders for 1700$.
Yota's, you end up with a flat deck.
Will the yota's of today outlast the jeeps of today. Maybe. But stating that like its some rule of thumb is near sited IMO.
We'll see how the 4 jk compares. With the exception of the lame v6, It seems fairly stout. I dont see the FJ sporting a 32 spline high pinion dana 44.
Personally I dont like them. And I do like old cruisers. Nothing about the new one really says cruiser to me.
Hopefully it improves.
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:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
bnine, that's awesome!
and mine's not even a new wrangler.....
dana 44's will outlast the toothpick axles on the yota
with the right parts, a 4.2 can blow the sox off of any i-6 or v-6.
you can't go wrong with the classic looks of an old fire-breather ( 2a, 3a, 3b or 5a/b) mines rusted, just surface rust and the back corners like all the yj's and fj's and anything else which has graceful ( see square :lol: ) lines.
dana 300 twin stick is prolly the best stocker t-case out there ( where in? JEEP!)
my t-150's been through a couplea rebuilds, the peugot tranny in the newer xj's are junk, so it evens out
...old jeeps rock, and you can't put a flat deck on the back (unless it's a J 20, 30, 3000, 4000 or an fc)
yotas are great trucks, i am gunna get a hilux surf to go around in, drive the jeep when it's warm, it's an equal balance.
old cruisers rok, new cruiser's sock.
and jason...that LAVitory is junk... gets stuck in anything because it weighs 12 tons.
:roll:
jeeps don't take too much to have a locker installed, and it's cheaper than having the monkeys in the dealership do it (ooo...scratches head)
i was out 4x4ing on lost knife ( i think...47-51-87-91-126-out) in waiparous and we came across a cruiser (new fj) mired (see horibly low clearance) on some ruts. it was a nice try, he had it all locked up too.
End Note...
The FJ is for the yuppies, much like the h2 & 3 are. the only time they'll ever be in 4 low is when the winters come around and lawyer joe needs something to get out of his drifted up driveway. you may come across the odd jacked up FJ in a 4x4 rag, but that's the small majority of them who are crazy enough ( and have enough electronical exp.) to mess around with new age parts. the jeep (wrangler rubicon) is still the best outta the box north american 4x4 for getting into - and out of, tough spots.
i've seen it and until i see a fj fording 3 food deep h2o, my opinion stands.
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Some good points Bill but look at the total package and not just one part from one against another. Consider quality, reliabilty and the way the vehicles are meant to be used etc.
There is no comparison between a 40 and a CJ. 40 hands down.
There is no comparison between a gen 1 or 2 4runner and a cherokee. 4Runner hands down.
Jeep truck vs Toyota trucks? No comparison.
There is no comparison between a 60 and a wagoneer.
Toyota makes powerful, reliable, fuel efficient engines that will routinely hit 500 000km with out a rebuild. There's a reason you won't find a jeep in the middle of a desert in Africa, the middle east or in the outback of Austraila.
I admit Jeep is the last company still producing a vehicle (for North America) that's meant for offroad with solid axles etc but I still wouldn't buy one. :lol: I'd do the extra work and import a 70 series LC with lockers, solid axles and a Toyota diesel. ....Steve
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this is not a toyota board. a Kaiser 715 WILL run a little flat-decked toy into the ground, i will put money on it.
that's all they are after all are toys. yes, they make fuel efficient, reliable engines, putting power into the mix isn't real on a little tiny 22r.
AMC 360 or a hemi in a CJ or wrangler made just as much, if not loads more power as well as being just as reliable. :P
i will also put money on the fact that the Golden Eagle or the Renegade edition of the CJ's will destroy any stocker fj offroad. and the only reason why you don't see jeeps down there is not because of the durability factor, our money is expensive down and out there. i have also seen plenty of jeeps hit 500 k, so it's a moot point. you're comparing the real with the fake.
the runner is better, because there's not much to compare them to, but other than that, you are looking at a true 4x4 (rubi or cj) and a yuppie magnet (FJ cruiser)
i know my cj will stand up to any abuse i want to throw at it. :P
and if you wanna pour 50 into it to do just what i can for only 5 then go ahead, i'll be at the top of the hill waiting for you, but until i have 5 to do what i want, ima goin' ta bed.
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a Kaiser 715 WILL run a little flat-decked toy into the ground, i will put money on it.
The Kaiser is a military truck with limited production. Why not compare similar vehicles and see how that works out.
Want to talk about power? Look at the 4L engines from both companies and see how they compare in HP and torque? Wonder which will last longer?
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and if you wanna pour 50 into it to do just what i can for only 5 then go ahead, i'll be at the top of the hill waiting for you, but until i have 5 to do what i want, ima goin' ta bed.
Not sure what this means?
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ok, first off, you'll never get the hp rating from a 22r that you will from a 360, 304 or 302 i-6 (mine's bored & stroked) the torque from the diesel may be a little more comprabe, but naturally aspirated, it has no hopes of making enough power to spin big tires thru the mud. you also have to look at fuels, compression ratios, and all of the other junk that gets thrown on them. i think it'llcome out about the same. there's no replacement 4 displacement ;)
ok...let's not compare the 715, but the J 3000, made by kaiser for the american market. that's easily the most rugged production pickup ever built for the american market in my mind, and will still cook the little toy.
pour 50 grand into your toy (including price), i'll throw another 5 into mine and we'll wheel, i bet it'll be me at the top of the hill.
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ok, first off, you'll never get the hp rating from a 22r that you will from a 360, 304 or 302 i-6 (mine's bored & stroked) the torque from the diesel may be a little more comprabe, but naturally aspirated, it has no hopes of making enough power to spin big tires thru the mud. you also have to look at fuels, compression ratios, and all of the other junk that gets thrown on them. i think it'llcome out about the same.
pour 50 grand into your toy (including price), i'll throw another 5 into mine and we'll wheel, i bet it'll be me at the top of the hill.
You're comparing 4cyl to a 6 again. I'll put the Toy 4cyl against the Jeep 4cyl any day though.
You can't be serious about your 5 and 50 grand thing? I don't even know what you drive but I'd bet you wouldn't be waiting for me at the top of any hill as my truck sits now.
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toy= toyota
:D
just to clarify...and i know about the little 4 bangers, i just like big engines, and i also find it hard that you can only get 150 hp out of an efi engine at insanely high revs (5800?!)... what went wrong there? torque on the 22r ( not even 22r anymore...3rzfe) isn't that great either...a whomping 177 lb/ft. (at 4 grand, another unreasonably high rev number)
jeep: wrangler
2.4 hp output = 147@3200
2.4 tq output= 185@3200
IMO the numbers speek for themselves, i pulled these offa the web, so they're prolly fuddled a little, but it looks like the jeep engine has more to it. now...as for high mileage stuff... if you take proper care of it, it'll last. if you don't it dosent. plain and simple.
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To each his own.
Personally the new FJ doesn't do it for me. I love the old ones, FJ's, BJ's, Trucks they're all great vehicles. If I were in the market for a new pickup today it'd be a Tacoma.
I'd question your claim that the toyota always wins "hands down". Apples to apples I've spent some time behind the wheel of a similar 4runner to my grand and I'd take my grand, not just cause I already own it. Both with 31's mine has better street manners, more room, better flex and ALOT more power. It's true that I've put money into it and the 4runner was stock but when you consider that the price of a new grand plus the stuff I've put into it is the same price as just the runner that is a non factor. As for reliability, my fuel pump just burn't up after 13 years and the water pump quit after 9 besides that it's been all regular maintance and fixing. With proper maintance I'm told 300k miles easy on the 318 which at my pace means I've got 30 more years. Realistically that's not the case so we'll see.
Apples to apples, an FJ beats a Liberty hands down...
Apples to apples, toyota offers NOTHING today to compete with the Wrangler...
Apples to apples, toyota offers NOTHING today to compete with the SRT8 Grand...:D
Apples to apples, you can't compare the efficiency of the two...I sometimes wish my 318 had japanese efficiency but at least it's got american rumble :roll:
You want to talk all around performance...
(http://www.landrover.com/us/en/Vehicles/Range_Rover/Overview_0C85C3B5-2A1F-4EE7-A789-253ED22F0657_502x670.jpg)
Bling, Bling!
Seriously though, the Toyota vs. Jeep thing is played...both have their merits and along with Land Rover all 3 share a storied past of good, reliable 4x4's...you just won't ever get a Toy guy to admit it.
Chevy vs. Ford...
(OK, that's a no brainer...Mopar...)
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jeep: wrangler
2.4 hp output = 147@3200
2.4 tq output= 185@3200
IMO the numbers speek for themselves,
These are the numbers for the Toy 4cyl. I guess they do speak for themselves.
Horsepower - 159
Torque - 180
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steve...those numbers are at unrealistically high revs for a 4 banger...they prolly set it up on the dyno and got those # just before it threw a rod.
i've been trying to tell you that each to his own, i think my jeep will kick the nutz off of any toyota, and you're a die hard toyota fan obviously...
kevinator's statement is right.
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There is no comparison between a 40 and a CJ. 40 hands down.
....Steve
How so Steve? CJ's came with smallblocks as an option, 40's were one of the first yota's to have sbc conversion kits built for them. To mimic the CJ.
40 drivetrain while strong, is rare, and hard to get parts for.
The CJ dana 300 is one of the most popular t-cases ever built, and a large part of the atlas design basis stems from those dana cases.
A dana 44 rear end was a CJ option as well. Comparible quality to the toy 8.25.
The CJ front dana 30 does lack, but the yota front comes with its own headaches, namely the Birfeild.
There is more aftermarket for the CJ then the 40, making for more competition and lower prices. Not that the 40 isnt well supplied with aftermarket, it just isnt as popular.
In my humble opinion, there isnt really any hands down about, both have ups and downs, and it boils down to preference.
Runner versus XJ. There's an old arguement. Basically you have 2 choices. Underpowered on a solid drivetrain. Or well powered on a so so drivetrain depending on year.
An xj with a 44 rear, hp30, 231 case, and ax 15 is just about as sound a drivetrain as a runner but not grossly underpowered.
With the runner you still have the problem of birfs, and only 1 year of solid front axle with efi.
Again, ups and downs.
Will the new JK rubi be able to keep up with the new cruiser in soccer mom standards? Probably not. But generally thats not what we are here to discuss. Hands down the new JK will out offroad any other production vehicle out of the box.
If we were looking for the best grocery getter then this discussion is moot, because I wouldnt buy either one.
I'd put my wife an kids in some mitsubishy, or korean suv that comes with a 10 year, 175,000km warrenty, with more bells, whistles, options, and all for less money then the "cool" 4x4's we are comparing.
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finnaly, some good debate on this forum!
Seriously, this is great.
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i think my jeep will kick the nutz off of any toyota,
That's the stupidest thing I've ever read but it would make for an interesting (embarrassing) day on the trails though.
I don't think those numbers are unrealistic for a 4cyl. 4000RPM is not high at all. Obviously you don't run it there all the time but when you need the power it's just a pedal push away.
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whatever, i don't care anymore, just drop it, toyota will always be the afterrunner of the jeep.
jeep came first, remember.
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whatever, i don't care anymore, just drop it, toyota will always be the afterrunner of the jeep.
jeep came first, remember.
You can't say something that stupid and walk away without backing it up. You said your Jeep would "kick the nutz off of any Toyota" so I would like to see how that would work. I'd be more than willing to spend a day at Waiporous on the trail of your choice just to see that happen.
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which toyota?
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which toyota?
Well since the FJ's apart right now and I don't drive it in the winter I would take the Tacoma.
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sure, i don't care, although, i don't have very much time right now...holding up a 4.0 gpa is hard work.
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whatever, i don't care anymore, just drop it, toyota will always be the afterrunner of the jeep.
jeep came first, remember.
You can't say something that stupid and walk away without backing it up. You said your Jeep would "kick the nutz off of any Toyota" so I would like to see how that would work. I'd be more than willing to spend a day at Waiporous on the trail of your choice just to see that happen.
Steve, I would suggest a day @ McLean, Waiparous doesn't have much to offer in terms of obstacles/challenges since the SRD :twisted: neutered the place. McLean has lots of tough trails/climbs :wink:
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McLean has lots of tough trails/climbs :wink:
This would be a fun one to start off on the way up the backside of Top of the World. :wink:
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well I ought to know better than to stay outta stuff and hopefully my comments are NOT vietnam all over agin :lol: .. but it just so happens I was out to wiaprious with a friend from work (in nov '01 I think) with a tacoma , it was about Nov with little to no snow but ice here and there, on an icy incline ( mockingbird trail ) he made it up and I didnt without a tug ... :oops: ... didnt really bother me nor should it cause I figure since I owned my jeep I've be dragged a couple of miles on skidders ... stuck is a fact of life ...
on any given day one vehicle may outperform another ... others have amazed me with what their vehicle can do and occasionally I get a comment I did remarkly well also .... always having fun regardless ...
in the pic above the jeep has a clear advantage in my opinion cause of the shorter wheelbase and breakover , on the wiaprious trip above the tacoma with longer wheelbase did better "maybe" cause of longer wheelbase and maybe cause it was an auto ... and the trd package has a locker ( I didnt at the time ) .... am sure on a different trail on a different day I would have gladly given the tacoma a tug ...
its all apples/oranges ... if the vehicles are identical then its the driver that makes the difference, on any given piece of terrain wheelbase, std vs automative, locker vs open, lift / tires and occasional luck make the difference ...
toyota make a good vehicle, jeep makes a good vehicle - wheel 'em and have fun ...
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in the pic above the jeep has a clear advantage in my opinion cause of the shorter wheelbase and breakover , on the incident above the tacoma with longer wheelbase did better cause of longer wheelbase and maybe cause it was an auto ... and the trd package has a locker ( I didnt at the time ) ....
I agree with you that each vehicle has it's strengths and weaknesses due to design.
Actually though, the Jeep in the above pic didn't make it up. In fact, only one rig did. You can make it out in the picture from halfway up the step. :shock:
I'm certainly not saying a Toyota will out-wheel a Jeep in every case and nor would a Jeep beat a Toy all the time. I've spent my share of time on the recieving end of a tow strap with a Jeep at the working end. I've also pulled my share out as well. It's part of working together and having fun with the guys you're with.
There isn't anyone I've wheeled with that I enjoy more than the CJA group. The best times I've had in my truck were always with Jeepers and I will continue to wheel with them every chance I get even though my breeding patterns have kept me home more than I would like for the last couple years. Once my girls are old enough to wheel they'll be out with me and hopefully back to the once a week trip to the mountains with "The Jeeps". Jeepers like Joey, Joel, Tom, Allen, Bill, Fragz, Ian, Vince and a few others are the reason I love wheeling so much.
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its like a flashback for me ... tacoma's are awesome climbers !
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Just got back from Moab.
i ran into two separate grooups of the new Cruiser.
First, i think they are ugly with white roofs and stupid tail lights but...............
THEY CAN FRICKIN WHEEL!!!!!!!
They were on Poison Spider, Golden Spike and Gold Bar Rim. There are plenty of tough ledges along that route and at least 3 were bone stock!! They got through easily.
Than i saw another group on Moab Rim a 4+ rated trail that has some nasty off camber ledges. They were up top coming back down. i was VERY impressed. Those things can wheel right off the showroom floor. i still think they are ugly but they absolutely suprised me to see them on Moab Rim Trail.
Without a doubt i would take one any day over a Cherokee and only a rubicon would i defend as a better off the showroom wheeler, no other jeep off the floor would hang with this new Cruiser.
Pics later.
Tom :)
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Totally stock FJC.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5KyVaeeW54
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Without a doubt i would take one any day over a Cherokee and only a rubicon would i defend as a better off the showroom wheeler, no other jeep off the floor would hang with this new Cruiser.
Pics later.
Tom :)
A cherokee versus a new FJ really isnt apples to apples anyways Tom.
Although, give me the change left over of buying a brand new xj with a d44 rear, hp d30 front, and 4.0, versus buying a new FJ, and dollar for dollar see what happens.
But, since the xj hasnt been available in almost 5 years, to keep it apples to apples, you would have to compre the unlimited rubi, or rubi 4 door jk to the FJ.
Either of those rigs will keep up with the FJ, have as strong, if not stronger drivetrain, and are several thousand less dollars to drive off the lot.
The new Rubi JK is going for 29.5 base. Canadian.
Thats with a disconnecting front sway bar, lockers front and rear, hp 32 spline, SFA d44 up front, lockers front and rear, and the rocktrac case. The rocktrac is arguebly one the strongest chain cases ever built. Rated as high as an atlas in torque capacity.
And the top still comes off :wink: :wink: :wink:
The aftermarket is already available to put the JK on 4 inches of lift and 37's!!!!.
IMO, the cruiser is more the grocery getter. Really, its just an updated 4 runner built for the nostalgia of it, since thats the trend these days.
While jeep is going more the grocery getter, built for comfort direction every year, I think they still retain more base offroad, and original styling/concepts then any other vehicle on the market.
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Bill,
i guess its hard for me to look at the new FJ and compare it to any swb or lwb wrangler as it really is closer to the cherokee and/or liberty. As i said the rubi wins hands down but that FJ suprised the heck out of me on Moab Rim.
They definitely can wheel! A FJ on 33 IROC's just sucessfully did Fish East on Thanksgiving weekend.
BTW, it was the NAXJA annual Moab week while i was there. i saw so many BEAUTIFUL XJ's in town, a cherokee fan's fantasy i tell you.
Pics later.
Tom :)
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Bill,
i guess its hard for me to look at the new FJ and compare it to any swb or lwb wrangler as it really is closer to the cherokee and/or liberty. As i said the rubi wins hands down but that FJ suprised the heck out of me on Moab Rim.
They definitely can wheel! A FJ on 33 IROC's just sucessfully did Fish East on Thanksgiving weekend.
BTW, it was the NAXJA annual Moab week while i was there. i saw so many BEAUTIFUL XJ's in town, a cherokee fan's fantasy i tell you.
Pics later.
Tom :)
Good to hear Tom, sounds like fun.
Yeah, I know what you mean, but the FJ is yota's biggest and baddest wheeler they put out. So IMO, comparing it to Jeeps grocery getter, is a bit unfair. Really, apples to apples is comparing both companies top, off the shelf 4wd units. Which of course is the wrangler series.
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yes... lets compare apples to apples...
first up is the FJ apples
(http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/668013/2/istockphoto_668013_rotten_apples.jpg)
next is the JK rubi apples...
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ee/Apples.jpg/180px-Apples.jpg)
how do you like them apples?
/end hijack