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Author Topic: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel  (Read 7524 times)

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Offline Raspberry

  • Budget Lift
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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2011, 03:16:50 PM »
When i got another jeep on 37.s...no snorkel.

At that point you're probably sitting too high to be able to suck water past the air filter anyway!
DECEASED - 'Big Ben' (black '97 XJ) : ~9" lift - 35's - Ford 9" - 4.56 gears - armoured up - ...and a sound system that can annoy the hell out of Lemon-aid Jay!!
NEXT - Dark green '98 XJ to build up....

Offline Jrama

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2011, 06:03:01 PM »
Seriously considering a set of Rubicon express arms, any experience with the super flex joint? I know about the rubber bushings problem, apparently it is fixed.

Probably end up with Currie arms as Northridge has them in stock and I want to go wheelin again soon. But if the RE arms are good I'll give them a shot, I know they flex good and they are less pricey

Offline binare

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2011, 06:29:44 PM »
Ive heard nothin but problems with slop on those joints. Jjs cant be added later without welding housings on and Id double check that they are back in business and making rebuilds.... youll need alot of em if you wheel anything beyond mediocre. Try Dave at Broken Axle too. He beat Northridge on price and shipping time and Im glad he did... Great guy to deal with.

Offline Jrama

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2011, 07:47:29 PM »
I appreciate your all your advice, I'll give Dave a call and see who can do the best price.

Offline w squared

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2011, 08:29:45 PM »
If you want to replace your control arms soon, then go ahead and buy cheap ones. If you want them to last for a while...Currie or Clayton would be the way to go.
I followed a rainbow out to a garage and found a leprichaun. The rainbow ended in a potted cactus on his porch, but there was no gold :(

Offline FirstTimer

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #20 on: October 13, 2011, 12:46:02 AM »
Jamal, this might help with your snorkel debate, http://www.spectreperformance.com/#CATALOG.9943. Spectre makes an intake that takes air from the cab through the fire wall. Not sure about noise level but seems pretty viable. As for CA, go currie jj, I ve done a lot of research over the past year and concluded that these are the ones. You just better not order up the last set from Stan at northridge4x4!  He has a pair on hold for me... Jk!!
02' Black TJ Apex on 33s, 2.5"  OME HD lift, Currie JJ CA on all four corners, 4:10 axles, Husky-Liner Rear Swing-Away Bumper and Bushwackers Flat Flares.

Offline dubbleJs

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #21 on: October 13, 2011, 07:21:59 AM »
I've got the RE superflex arms on my XJ and they are BRUTAL. I rebuilt the axle end spherical ball joints when I first got them cause they were pooched, a few months after that they were clunking around again so I pulled them out, tightened a couple turns and put them back in, that lasted 2 or 3 wheelin trips til they were clunking again. Im getting rid of them asap...

As for the intake I just ditched the box and turned my intake arm towards the pass side, put on the longest length of 3" PVC I could and a K&N cone filter on the end of it. Gives the motor more air and solves my intake problem. If the entire hood is under water then the intake might get wet but by then you probably have other problems too...   :P

Here's a pic
« Last Edit: October 13, 2011, 07:25:37 AM by dubbleJs »
'91 XJ - 3" procrap - cutout for 33" MT's  - More and more dents every run...Sold.
'98 XJ - Lifted, locked and lovin' it

Offline Jrama

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #22 on: October 13, 2011, 08:01:38 AM »
Good to know about the RE arms,  I am for sure getting the Currie. As for the intake, I think a DIY cowl intake seems to be the best route. Something like this http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f140/tj-cowl-induction-snorkle-598857/ is what I am considering. My only concern is that if you push a wave over the hood it kinda ends up right in your filter, plus it rains/snows I am not sure how well it will do.

Offline morerpmfred

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #23 on: October 13, 2011, 09:15:06 AM »
There are drains in the fresh air plenum so that watwr draons out.
Here is mine on an xj though. could not get a snorkel with raised fender flares and abs to fit. the filter is a huge six by nine cone style. Cost me about 25$ as already had a new filter.

Offline Dagoose

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #24 on: October 13, 2011, 10:15:21 AM »
That's what I plan to do when I have some free time. I'm looking at mounting a Ford Winstar box inside the engine compartment and routing the tubing to cowl. Like Andy has above, maybe a little more pretty than that  ;).

Offline binare

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #25 on: October 13, 2011, 10:54:44 AM »
Why not just keep the stock box and filter. Reroute the intake to the cowl. Remove the existing horn.. silicone a spray paint can lid in place of... and make a new hole coming out the rear of the stock box. Then you can change your filters easier. Leaves room to 90 the portion in the cowl facing up... juuust in case you get alot of water in there... youll notice it on your floor before it ever fills enough to syphon into the box. Or 90 down and drill a small hole in the top of the 90, itll gurgle like mad if water ever tries to creep down creating a durso effect.

Offline binare

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #26 on: October 13, 2011, 10:57:09 AM »
And while your in the cowl.... get a roof vent adapter and throw a cone filter on the fresh air intake.... say goodbye to the dust.

Offline Dagoose

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2011, 12:08:21 PM »
Quote
Why not just keep the stock box and filter. Reroute the intake to the cowl. Remove the existing horn.. silicone a spray paint can lid in place of... and make a new hole coming out the rear of the stock box. Then you can change your filters easier. Leaves room to 90 the portion in the cowl facing up... juuust in case you get alot of water in there... youll notice it on your floor before it ever fills enough to syphon into the box. Or 90 down and drill a small hole in the top of the 90, itll gurgle like mad if water ever tries to creep down creating a durso effect.

I've also seen someone with that setup, very slick. I have a K&N intake, so I need to replace the entire intake system (or trade for a stock one).

Offline JJonesee

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #28 on: October 15, 2011, 10:42:22 AM »

There is lots of good info in the thread about snorkels. 

I can tell you that if I ever decide to mount one, it will be routed above the heater coil in the upper portion of the dash.  Don't kid yourself, it will be noisy..

As for control arms, it depends on your wheeling and budget....  JJ and RE full flex are great for full flex and droop, lots of articulation.  Often overlooked is the Trackbars..  Essentially in a 5 Link system it will bind up long before the joint sees its maximum travel.. To understand the TJ/WJ/XJ 5 link, the factory "pierces" the axle and frame brackets at a predetermined location to set the Caster at the optimum for the vehicle. Caster is essentially not adjustable in a majority of these vehicles. (I dont count cam bolts, as the manufactures dont use them anymore)  Look at a factory jeep, the arms have almost zero angle relative to the plane of travel.  Lift kits change this force loading drastically when the angle increases.

Stock arms provide the best flex of any short arm on the market..  Cheap and easily found. Replacement bushings are around $8..  Ive seen more than one rig on a short arm lift ramp well over 1000 rti on factory arms..  Just carry a spare.. And you cant correct Caster, so your limited to less than 3" lift.

So - why even buy new arms?  The primary reason is to have the length adjustable to correct Caster.

My 2 cents -

The poly bushing style arms are more than adequate for less than 5" of short arm lift and a majority of the terrain I have found in the area.  The length is often adjustable.  Poly bushings are not created equal, so do your homework.   Less cost to replace, and often can use factory style cartridge bushings on the frame end for a better ride.  Easily built to length.. Some have a "swivel" feature, which increase the flex.  Keep them clean and in good shape.. (Ask any YJ owner..)

Heims - not usually found on street rigs with forward 5 link, since you may as well remove your springs and weld the axle to the frame.

JJ, RE, (Rebuildable spherical joints) - are the best combination of poly bushings and heims.  Arguably the correct joint for high angle side loads and minimal dampening.  Cost is by far the highest.  Can be rebuilt, and again are often found with factory style cartridge joints on the frame end for a better ride. The best of the best is Evolution joints.  There is a reason you see them in high end race applications. 

All that said - I run a set of RE double flex arms (bought used for next to nothing from someone upgrading to long arm and rebuilt).  The ones with the Joint on one end and the rubber hourglass bushing on the other.  As for their spherical joints, if properly maintained are an excellent joint for the price.. The rubber hourglass was a good idea - it offered the same ride as a factory bushing, but allowed more flex.  RE got a bad name when they experienced quality problems with the hour glass bushings. (I was chewing through a set in a month of street driving)   I have made about a year on my last set of hourglass bushings I received from RE, just before they closed.  I intend to replace with a factory style joint or a JJ just for availability.  RE is back open, and I will let them prove quality before I try them. I can say that without question they would send me a new bushing, no hassle.  I had great customer service with them..  I dont doubt my ability to build arms, but these were cheaper than I could build, Cr parts and spherical joints..

There are tons of good quality brands  out there. Poor maintenance and improper caster will ruin any option.  Another big problem is folks will tighten the control arm bolts prior to setting the vehicle on the ground and allowing the suspension to take weight.  The proper procedure is to get the bolt in, sit it on the ground and tighten to full torque.  (This is a good rule of thumb for most suspension based components on jeeps.)

Dont buy into the "spend as much as possible and you wont have problems"

Tech note: You can replace arms easier on a 5 link system without lifting the vehicle off the ground.  Place a jack under the frame and lift until the bolt slides out.  Just do one arm at a time..

Disclaimer - if you have long arms the loading is not the same, and you need to review the designs again.


06' Rubicon LJ
52' M-100
82' Scrambler x 3

Offline Jrama

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Re: Control Arm Recomendation / Snorkel
« Reply #29 on: October 15, 2011, 06:19:57 PM »
Good advice and lots of info. I can agree with you from personal experience about stock arms. My caster is terrible and that is why an aftermarket arm has been ordered.

Right now at 3" suspension lift and 1.25 BL with 35" tires, I have a total of 4" bump stop extensions and it still just rubs the fender, I have about 6 inches of up travel, which I hear is all you really need.  How much more practical flex can I obtain from Johnny Joints in my situation? not much more as the coil will fall out, or as you said the track bar will really start to become the limiting factor. In the rear the ultimate goal is to eliminate the track bar entirely, but that is not for some time.

I ended up buying a set of Currie lowers: Which leaves me with a couple questions

Would "progressive" springs help solve the spring falling out problem? Or is there a spring that is very long unloaded that swell up to not leave gaps at full flex?

How much extra performance is gained from aftermarket front uppers? I think I'd rather get the JJ track bar and leave the uppers for...ever.

I really like my short arm lift, it rides well, flexes good and is relatively modest in terms of price (that is changing quickly), for my lift and tire size I have heard that long arms are not really that beneficial.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2011, 06:40:32 PM by Jrama »